Most all of humanity existed in a lower CO2 in the atmosphere.

In a bit of irony, in that era, the more likely problem was the opposite - global coolingYou could get a huge volcano eruption that pumps particulates and sulfur aerosols into the atmosphere. And it would cool the earth for some time. That is also where some people get the idea of aerosol injection to cool the planet, which is like saying "We'll cool teh earth, and put up with a thousand years of acid rain and it's health effects on animal, destroying buildings, acidifying the oceans and destroying forests. A terrible idea, but with all the FUD, some think it is a good idea - or else they ignore the likely greater destruction. It would probably cause more extinctions than AGW.

But back to the volcanoes I came up with a doomsday scenario based upon a huge eruption cycle that cooled the earth for say a decade. A number of huge volcanic eruptions pump large amounts of fine volcanic ash and Sulfur aerosols into the atmosphere. It has happened in the past, with 536 C.E. being considered the worst example, almost 2 years of crop failures. There were indeed deaths worldwide. Now possibly connected due to a weakened state, a plague a few years later, and the end was around half of humanity left.

Today, the results could be pretty horrifying. We could have crops fail in places where surplus food is shipped to other nations that already have a shortage of food the shipments make up for the deficit. So we could end up with an even larger percentage end up dead.

In irony, this could happen in an AGW affected earth. Is it likely? No. But you never know. The earth doesn't really care about humanity, almost every living organism on earth has gone extinct. It is hubris to believe we are exempt.

Of course, and make no mistake, there are going to be some extinctions, So it isn't all based on the rate of change, though a lot is. Like at the end of the Pennsylvanian period, where so much CO2 had been sequestered, temperatures dropped.

That sequestered CO2 is a big part of the mess we have now. We de-sequestered it in the form of coal and oil.

You aren't kidding! Young women need role models that aren't pop culture divas.

The only caveat is that the promoters sometimes have a problem of adding digs at men, as in telling us how men suppressed women.

So rather than say "Annie Jump Cannon" was an incredible Astronomer, who took on the daunting work of cataloging stars, even creating the first they say how she was ignored, and uncelebrated because of the patriarchy. Fact is she had many accolades and was extremely worthy of them. https://ancillary-proxy.atarimworker.io?url=https%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2F...

Or how Hedy Lamarr invented spread spectrum and I've even heard WiFi, and the articles spent most of the time on how she was not rewarded because she was a woman, and that she was only appreciated for her beauty. In fact, she partnered with George Anthiel, a composer, and put out a patent in the end. It was a little late for WW2, but still a very good work. She and he were eventually inducted into the Inventors hall of fame. Probably the proper accolade.

Point is, it is a great thing to give young women positive science and technology role modelsIt is perhaps not as good a thing to encourage hatred of men at the same time by adding how they were so horribly repressed. Because at that time, it sends a message of misandry.

While your concern is applaudable, explain how during times in the past when CO2 was much higher than now, the world didn't end.

This is not for a second to deny the energy retention of an atmosphere being controlled by its gaseous composition. This is not to suggest that this isn't a big problem.

Your idea is pure FUD. Fact is, we've been through warming and cooling cycles before. The world is not ending. The oceans will not become lifeless. There will be problems - some substantial. But doom and gloom hand-wringing doesn't help.

I hadn't considered that part, and it is a really good point about people starting their day around the only time they can get some decent sleep.

For people who might be living in more arid parts of the world, humidity can be a real beotch. And we're"used" to it here. At one of my work sites, it was a beautiful fall day, sunny, 70 degrees, around 55 percent humidity. I was loving it. I was working with a guy based in Southern Arizona. He was suffering. Good thing he wasn't here in July!

I don't think they think that far ahead. So unintended consequences bite them in the backside all the time.

It always helps to ask questions like Why did time get coordinated in the first place? Until the early 1800's most places kept local time, as in directly tied to the sun. So every town/area had it's own time. Think of it as hundreds of thousands of mini time zones.

Then along come the railroads. As they branched out, there was a need to have more coordinated time. Needed to have it known what point in time what train was likely to be where. We don't want the trains running into each other.

So we had to sit down and figure out time zones in a manner that made for easy calculation, taking into account that even from east to west in any given time zone , sunrise and sunset will differ somewhat. since the world operates on a 24 hour clock, 24 time zones was then logical choice.

Especially radio which was a worldwide communication tool, everything had to be synchronized. If I have a contact in say, Japan, and we need to talk at a certain time, we bother have to know just what time it is. Enter Greenwich Main Time, known known as Universal coordinated time. When it is 0910 in Eastern US it is 0910 in Japan. Just figure out the local time which is either added or subtracted.

But what this fixed time and time zoned approach does not have is a lattitude based differential As noted, places near latitude zero don't have much difference in day/night length, and the further north or south you go, the larger the variance in seasonal day/night cycle there is.

So DST was born. It wasn't a group of stupid people creati gnit, and it wasn't people trying to kowtow to farmers in Minnesota. It was dealing with the issues created by necessary changes in a connected world.

It's why people in my latitude don't want the sun to rise at 8:30 A.M. in December and January if we go permanent DST. And as noted before, I'm at around 40 degrees latitude.

Unfortunately, few politicians are versed in physics, so I guess this will be a case of FAFO. The likely result is a repeat of the 1970's permanent DST failure.

Never thought of epoch time! The ultimate revenge of the nerds! 8^)

During the longest days many of the outside contractors in my area tend to tie their workday to the light/dark cycle. There are times here in PA where it is getting light at 4 in the morning! That's like bonus time toward meeting the schedule. And you are correct about the heat. We have the added humidity (it hung around 100 percent this past summer) Upper 80's and 100 percent humidity plays hell on construction workers.

Although it is mainly a transfer of energy use. But what makes me laugh is just how the intersection of solipsism and stupidity runs so deep in these matters.

Even the name "Sunshine Protection Act" the hill politicians have chosen to die on, is 100 percent wrong. The amount of sunshine in any 24 hour cycle is a matter of physics, not something politicians can vote on.

But a person who gets up at 7:00 A.M. and works a day shift. sees how it is light longer in the summer, and is stupid, thinks that all that is needed is to keep DST, and the day will be longer. And their solipsism has them thinking everyone else would benefit from that. I meant who could oppose a longer day? There are times here when it is getting light at 4 in the morning. Then it makes some sense to shift, people who work outside like that, especially in temperate zones. Hours wasted in the morning, unless you want to start work at 4 AM. But on the other end of the stick, if DST becomes permanent, in my area, during December and January, sunrise will happen around 0830, with 0835 being the latest. And I'm in PA. Around 40 degrees North, not even halfway up the latitudes.

But the solipsists don't care, and stupid is not fixable.

I've been on planes with hundreds of people per flight. Their experience is the same as mine. No one keeled over. This ain't just me homie. And I'm not going to provide citations with everyone I ever flew with - that's thousands of people. I only relate that people don't die because they changed timezones. If this was a regular occurrence across many people, people would notice.

That you think that my relating a personal experience over many years is flawed reasoning only shows you didn't have anything useful to say, but that didn't stop you from saying something. Good work, coward.

Must be Drinkypoo derangement syndrome. That was a misread on my part, mea maxima culpa's all around But.....

Validate your claim that DST kills people. Shifting a timezone should have exactly the same effect. One hour plus or minus, should be showing dead people as a direct cause. And I don't take back that you are solipsistic.

Shifting one timezone should have exactly the same effect. Death. Explain why it does not.

So when we are on permanent DST, I have to go to work late in December? Or at 4 in the morning during the summer? And across time zones and latitudes, making corrections for everyone?

Sorry, but perhaps in prehistoric times up to the early 1700's your "natural" system might work. It definitely does not in an interconnected world. A whole lot of us have to know what time people show up for work in cities and countries we communicate with. Example: One place I would call was on the west coast. Their workday was 7:30 to 4:30. They were 3 hours behind my time. So if I need to call them at my time, I have to wait until 10:30 Eastern Time. If I have to call Mumbai Adding an element of randomness is just going to make the juggling worse

You think changing the clocks twice a year fixes everything?

Of course it doesn't. Low latitudes have almost no difference in day night cycle, and the higher you go in latitude, the more the dy night cycle shits over teh year, and at the highest latitudes, no adjustment is actually possible that would do anything.

We have modern tech that lets us have flexible scheduling, even schools are now flexible enough that on bad weather days the children take classes from home (yes that is proving to not work but the tech is here). So your fix is making working parents continually change their workday, and hiring an au pair? And each day will be a little different. What is more, everyone who works will have to calculate the start time for any place they call. If I need an answer when I get into work, but the person I'm calling won't be in for another hour, that's cray cray.

Sounds more like chaos to me.

I had an assistant who at one point would call me when I was out of town. He'd call at 8:00 East coast time, while I was on the west coast. 5:00 in the morning. After the fifth time, I told him I was going to smack him if he did it again when I got back. Three hours difference.

Now your solution amps that up to the point of randomness. Time zones is fairly simple. Time zones plus different times of work depending on latitude - that's just chaos.

Keep the time where it belongs - unchanging - and fix your work and school hours to match the time of year. This is no longer a problem with modern technology that is stuck on your nose all day - thanks to the smart phone we no longer need the dumb clock gymnastics that is DST.

Here's a solution for you. Universal coordinated time. UCT is the same time around the world. You don't have to ever change what time it is. Then you can do the adjusting in your work times, and you don't have to guess what time it is to do business. I use UCT all the time, because my business is all around the world. If DST is an insufferable experience, You'd faint in the gymnastics needed to say, find a time to call Mumbai, and would have a heart attack when you found to that some places are actually tomorrow at times while you are at some time today.

Look up the differences between latitudes.

Why don't we all have our personal times? Don't let the man tell you what time it is. 8^)

You are a rather solipsistic fellow aren't you? You never got on or off a bus in the dark so no one does. Look up the day night cycles. Here in PA, the sunrise is at 7:35 A.M. on December 30th. Add permanent DST, and it becomes 8:35 And it gets worse further north. https://ancillary-proxy.atarimworker.io?url=https%3A%2F%2Fsunrise-sunset.org%2F Consider other people

Right, DST kills people. Here's your problem. If DST kills people, then why aren't people who regularly shift time zones drop over dead? I regularly did 3 time zone shifts, back and forth between the home in the east, and the west coast, even some to Alaska. I got on a plane, and got off a plane, and no one died.

I had Jet lag, for sure, but never felt ill, just a little strange.

If one hour kills people, then 3 or 4 hour shifts should have a greater effect. Explain why not?

It does that, but a lot of us regularly shift several time zones and back.

Jet lag is real and it doesn't feel all that great. But it is the price we pay. On short trips, I could just keep my regular cycle. If it was longer than a week, the body just adapts no matter how hard I try.

What is interesting to me is that after a career with a lot of extensive time zone shifts. a one hour change doesn't bother me at all.

Probably the biggest PITA is dealing with the pets. I try to just adapt a bit earlier or later, each day, until they are on what the think is their schedule aligns with the clock again

And I regularly felt coast to coast USA, That three time zone difference should have killed me outright, if the westward flight didn't coming back east should have. Here's the truth. The earth is a oblate spheroid rotating on a tilted axis relative to the sun.

As it orbits the sun, that tilt creates different light/dark cycles. over the course of the orbit

Near the equator, there is not much difference over the course of the year. And it is not unusual for people living there to find the clock changes silly.

As the latitude increases, people there experience larger and larger changes in teh day/night respective lengths. Here in PA, it is significant, some hours one way or the other between summer and winter.

A bit further, like say Canadian cities, it becomes even more extreme. DST to ST? . You'll probably Go to work in the dark, and drive home in the dark. But it still helps

Finally, at the really high latitudes, no amount of correction helps. Their summers, there is no dark cycle, and the winters, no light cycles.

We tried permanent Daylight savings time during the Arab Oil Crisis. And people hated it, we went back to ST/DST pretty quickly.

Oddly enough, permanent DST was sold as the way to save money on fuel. It didn't. Some politicians seemed to even think that it would somehow make the day longer. I do not see that the general IQ and smarts these days.

So we have stupid people wanting permanent DST, we have ostensibly smart people who didn't think about the latitude issue, and solipsistic people living at low latitudes that don't care about those at the higher latitudes.