Comment Seems... Ominous. (Score 1) 144
Hopefully I'm wrong!
AI-guided compilers? So the program might run and do what its supposed to do this compile? Maybe not? Yeah lets not do that. How about an AI-guided ISA and architecture design instead? It would most certainly be something where memory isnt flat at all, making it quite different from current systems and will probably demand well matured programming language support.
I'm not suggesting anything remotely like that.
With VLIW, parallelism isn't abstracted by the CPU (you get to deal with parallelism directly in the ISA) as speculative execution is moved to the compiler. Unsurprisingly, compilers were never very good at this... But apparently you could get good performance out of Itanium with hand-tuned assembly, which isn't really practical to expect all software to have such optimizations (especially since need to recompile your software for newer VLIW CPU iterations much more than with traditional CPU designs).
Perhaps AI could determine the best set of instructions for the most amount of parallelism (performance). And likely it could do so in a deterministic manner to produce consistent binaries.
That being said, I would think that there are still some advantages to the CPU determining the best way to execute instructions runtime, because a compiler can't know the current state of the CPU.
apart from being at the bottom of the ocean, why is the Itanic immune to speculative execution vulnerabilities?
With VLIW, the speculative execution is supposed to be done by the compiler. The parallelism is built directly into the instruction set rather than obscured by the CPU and then determined at runtime.
Reading about VLIW it's quick to see that this is one of those ideas that must've sounded great in academia, but wouldn't pan out in the real world (at least for general purpose CPU's).
Intel kept saying Itanium will perform, we just need better compilers! But this never really panned out which isn't at all surprising. But with AI, maybe you could actually determine the optimal instructions and parallelism for the best performance.
Apparently you could get pretty good performance (parallelism) with hand-tuned assembly, but to hand optimize all your software is pretty impractical.
Yeah fuck me for buying from the only two x64 vendors.
There's always IBM POWER. https://ancillary-proxy.atarimworker.io?url=https%3A%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2F...
I love IBM POWER! I own 2 POWER9 systems from https://ancillary-proxy.atarimworker.io?url=https%3A%2F%2Fraptorcs.com%2F. A Talos II based system and a Blackbird based system. I also intend to buy one of their new systems in 2025 if I can scrounge up the money.
However, at least POWER9 is vulnerable to meltdown (and I think aarch64 is as well). So far as far as speculative execution vulnerabilities go everything is vulnerable except like Itanium.
Maybe with AI guided compilers VLIW could actually be viable.
but can you trust IBM? They do the same things to their corporate customers as Oracle, to be thugs to intimidate and squeeze extra unnecessary license money from under all manner of false pretense, even to making customers waste thousands of dollars worth of time to build and maintain license management server that constantly scans environment including virtualization management for use in IBM audits.
IBM are power and money grubbing thugs, they might toss OpenPower to the curb or come back someday and try to squeeze users.
No, I don't particularly trust IBM. But I do trust Raptor. I don't know if they ever released the full details of their audit... But I think they audited multiple chips/architectures and found POWER was safe.
Out of interest, what is the performance like? What does it bring to the table to justify the 10000 price tag I see on the website? One can buy a hell of a lot of Xeon or AMD horsepower for that amount of money.
Well, POWER9 came out in 2018 IIRC and is 14 nm... So it's a bit behind to be sure. When these cheaps came out, I felt that the price/performance was fairly competitive compared to Xeon. If you look at the prices for just the CPU's alone, for the server market, it's not TOO terrible. I did a small amount of price comparisons back when these CPU's first launched to the Xeons of that day, and thought the prices were fairly good.
A lot of the cost comes from the motherboards. They were expensive in 2018 or so, but then we had tariffs, and then we had supply chain issues due to the global shutdowns and these have really driven prices up.
I built my own Talos II based box using a 2U server chassis to save several thousand dollars. Raptor CS validates the builds they make for you so you pay a lot more... But in the process of building my own, I certainly ran into a number of headaches... Hilariously, one of them is that the IO shield that came with the board was _really_ difficult to get to fit into the Supermicro chassis (same one they were using at the time). Speaking to Tim Pearson of Raptor on IRC, he said it seemed Supermicro's tolerances weren't quite right and it was a pain for them too.
Anyway, the motherboards for these systems are really niche so in addition to all the aforementioned issues contributing to the costs, they aren't sold in high enough quantities to bring the costs down so it's going to be very expensive. So unless you have a really strong interest in the platform (ie, fully audited/trustworthy, have a strong hobby or professional interested in POWER, hate money, etc) there's not much reason to buy. I really hope we can switch to POWER11 at some point, but it's still at least somewhat up in the air so who knows?
The open aspects of these systems are really nice. The BMC firmware didn't and probably still doesn't come with iptables. So I built my own image and added iptables and added a little firewall script. Similarly, the system firmware runs petitboot, which is just Linux as well. I built my own petitboot image to add support for a SAS controller (Adapter HBA 1100-4i) I wanted to boot from and that has been working great for years now.
And finally, I had a fair amount of fun teaching myself some PPC64 assembly.
Is there that many POWER specific things to do? Isn't it mainly for running commercial wares on AIX or System i
I write platform independent code, can run on everything from MS-OS (with networking installed) to IBM mainframe (guess the language). Not seeing a use case for POWER.
Not really. If you want hardware in the modern era you can actually trust, this is the way to go though.
I'm a fan of using other architectures out of a hobby, and it did remind me of running old SPARC workstations back in the day.
The way to make a small fortune in the commodities market is to start with a large fortune.