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Journal bethanie's Journal: [Rant/Whine] Kids are people, too, dammit!! 24

So I got a latte AND a pedicure AND a haircut today. Cushy fuckin' life, I know.

But I'll tell you -- it was stressful as all hell. By the time I got home from that (which took 20 minutes longer than it should have, 'cause we were nearly home when I asked where Squirt's dollbaby was and realized that Kiddo had not, as instructed, kept track of it; it was still back at the hair place) I was utterly frazzled. I mean, literally shaking.

My children are not particularly badly behaved. Actually, Kiddo is an absolute ANGEL in situations like these. She always has been. And even Squirt is a good little monkey, albeit a very curious one.

But I find it next to impossible to try to go places with them where I cannot keep them physically restrained (like in a shopping cart or a high chair), and even then I'm doing good if it's 20 minutes before they (particularly Squirt) start vocalizing their protests against such injustice.

And as I've said -- it's not that the children are so badly behaved. They each behave like a normal, healthy, intelligent, well-loved (and fairly well-disciplined) 5.5- and 2-year-old.

The problem is that our culture simply is NOT child-friendly.

In professional situations, including most commercial ones, children are simply not accounted for. It's like we want to deny their existence. Or, more likely, charge their caregivers with full responsibility for keeping them contained and entertained. And god forbid that the kids should make noise or follow their own naturally healthy curious impulses.

'Cause they might get hurt. That baby might stick her finger in the fan and get cut! She could put her hand on the neon light and get burned! She could fall off that chair she's climbing on and... fall off!

Well, my answer to all of those things is that, yes, she might. And if she does, then she will have learned a valuable lesson. And it still won't cost me an ER visit, 'cause none of those things is serious enough to call for a trip to the hospital.

It's late and I'm exhausted and I'm afraid I won't be coherent enough to make my point clearly. So far it sounds like I'm whining because other people won't entertain my kids when I take them places. But really, that's not what I'm whining about.

My issue is that I think that we, as a society, *should* acknowledge that we have children amongst us. That they have needs and will need attending to and can't always be as quiet or patient as we want them to be.

Now, I'm the first one to sternly cut my child short and tell her she's interrupting a conversation inappropriately -- but she also deserves to be acknowledged and respected like a human being. Don't just keep on casually chitchatting as if you can't see that she's there pulling on my shirt trying to catch my attention.

As adults, we have better social graces than that, and by modelling them for our children we're teaching them a valuable lesson.

And really, would it kill places of business to have a small, child-sized table off in some corner, or a plastic box with a few toys or books stashed away? These are things that I would like to see at the manicure place, at the coffee shop, at the hair salon, at the bank, at the clothing store... Some little area that's safe and child-friendly -- fun and engaging, to show them that they are respected and valued, too.

Of course I have a bag of toys stashed in the back of my station wagon. I would no sooner leave the house without them than without extra diapers or a bit of snack stashed away in my backpack. I know it's primarily *my* responsibility to look after my kids, or to hire someone else to do the job in my stead.

But damn if it just wouldn't make my life a hell of a lot easier if there were places *available* to go that had some kind of set up appropriate for small children (and preferably some place that wasn't trying to seduce them into eating nasty, processed, palate-numbing crap). Squirt is one of those kids who will ALWAYS favor different, new stuff over familiar, old stuff. She's been that way from birth. So when we go out, the bag of toys (even if it's a brand new assortment) will immediately take a back seat to that kayak set out in the corner of the room or that chair on rollers or those colorful bottles on the shelf.

My options are to restrain her on my lap, which invariably elicits screams, or to let her explore at will, which often results in a bit of disorder (although *very* seldom any damage or injury). I'm damned either way. I try to be as considerate as possible of the circumstances -- keep my kids quiet, keep them from wrecking the place, clean up any messes that they make -- but there's only so much I can do. I can't make them NOT be kids. I can't immobilize and mute them. They exist, they're here, and they have a place in our society.

If society made just a little bit of an effort to acknowledge and accommodate THEM, we would ALL get along that much better.

And I might not be shaking and on the verge of tears by the time I got home from an afternoon of errands.
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[Rant/Whine] Kids are people, too, dammit!!

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  • Banks are starting to get the message ... I saw one last week with a drawing board and chair, and a large roll of paper so that kids can draw away instead of whining "I'm bored". Spred the word where you bank, and maybe they'll copy it.

    • Yeah, the car dealership I go to has a moderately sized, plexiglass enclosed (i.e., noise reduction!) play area with a plastic cube-y thing for the kids to climb on, and a laundry basket of Happy Meal toys. Makes it *so* much easier for me to go there when I need service on my car.

      And the place where I bought the lights and plumbing fixtures and appliances for my house, too -- they've designated a whole closet for kids.

      And it works. I'm *so* much more likely to linger (and thus to spend more money) when
      • Same with my Honda dealership. I don't get my car serviced there, but it made the day-long buying process much easier. They actually had pretty decent quality toys, they were in relatively good shape, and when another kid broke one, one of the sales managers took it away, and returned with a new different toy to replace it (they had a closet full of gently used toys, knowing that kids break toys regularly).

        I too take it upon my own responsibility to try to keep my own son entertained. At the grocery stor
    • When I bought my car, the CarMax had an indoor play area with a staff member watching the kids while the parent(s) were shopping.

      Those places do exist, but, in many cases, parents with young kids aren't part of the target demographic for the business. You're not expected to have the money to spend I guess. We went shopping at Lowes last week with the baby and Mercer both... I have no idea how one person can even try to do it alone. Perhaps it's slightly easier when the kids are a little older, but Mercer wa
  • The minute a place provides a play area/quiet area/items for children they then become responsible if a little-one manages to hurt themself over there.

    I will note that most malls have gone quite far in making things a lot easier for getting around with little ones (changing areas, family rest rooms, feeding areas, play areas, etc) but that's just good business for them.

    I guess this could be a good free-lance business opportunity. Create a small "kid korner kit" (maybe the acronym isn't too good :-D) that y
    • Those are not changing tables! DON'T USE THEM! http://babysmasher.com/ [babysmasher.com]

      Beyond just not caring, I think there are two big reasons why businesses avoid having these play areas. First, liability. If they provide some toy that is dangerous and a kid gets injured, then they could possibley be sued. And since they provided the "entertainment center" for the kid they would be bound to have to make sure all the toys were safe and no recalls and all the overhead associated with that. Second, is simpley a lack of
  • Sadly, many parents are not particularly good. They WOULD sue if they got hurt in a play area. They WOULD take their brat to the ER for a minor scrape. They WOULD use the facility to ignore their kids.
    • They WOULD use the facility to ignore their kids.


      I'm not clear on the difference between 'using the facility to ignore their kids' and 'using the facility to occupy their kids while they go off to shop.' I'm not just trying to be difficult; I really just don't understand how these play areas would make the shopping, etc experience better, because don't you have to take the kid with you when you go back to shopping? I guess this question applies more to desiring play areas inside larger stores, as opposed
      • Well, in my case, I am doing business in the immediate vicinity -- within sight of where my kids would be playing.

        Leaving kids to play gets a LOT more complicated, 'cause there's potty training and kidnapping and all that kind of crap to consider. Ikea has a great system set up, as do other places, as mentioned in others' comments.

        The thing is, having a play area for kids doesn't make businesses any more or less liable if a kid gets hurt on their premises. But in my opinion, it makes it less likely that
        • While it doesn't make the store more liable per se (because anything could fall under 'attractive nuisance'*) it makes the stores's liability more likely to be called into question because parents would be less vigilant about watching their kids.

          While it would be great if everybody could just take responsibilty for things that are their own damn fault/learning experience, that won't happen.**

          [*] I think the 'attractive nuisance' idea is dumb, and anybody stupid enough to crawl over a fence and injure/maim/
      • I'm not clear on the difference between 'using the facility to ignore their kids' and 'using the facility to occupy their kids while they go off to shop.'

        It's the difference between watching a titration right at the beginning, and watching it when the next drop will cause the solution to go to equilibrium. There is an intensity of interaction with the one that is not present in the other.
  • Because just about every business that could be reasonably expected to have parents with kids in tow come in had something for them to do, even if it was just a little Duplo/Lego table with blocks. One of our favorite grocery stores even had a locked in supervised play area where the kids would have access to toys and group activities. They gave you an in-store pager if there was an emergency, and you got a serial number strip on your wrist to make sure someone else couldn't abscond with the little ones.

    • WHERE IS THIS GROCERY STORY YOU SPEAK OF???

      ------------------
      *sigh* I'm yelling on purpose Slashdot! You'd figure after years of being on this site, it might eventually learn to trust the fact I'm not a troll. Oh well. One reason I rarely post here.
      • Bashas' on the southwest corner at Baseline and Greenfield in east Mesa.

        Are you currently residing in the Copper State? I moved from there five months ago. I really like my new job, but I miss just about everything else. I would contemplate murder right now if it guaranteed me an Ethiopian dinner.

  • My horde is all preschoolers (4, 4, and 3), and it is damn hard to go places with just yourself and the kids - for example, I took time off while my wife went to visit a friend in Seattle, so I took the kids with me to the BMV to get my Tennessee drivers license (what can I say, I like a challenge). I had some small books and toys for them, and fortunately, found some small unopened toys just before we went in, so the kids were great and I was actually able to get my license with them remaining reasonably
    • My son Nathan (two and a half) absolutely refuses to sit in the shopping cart anymore. He'll scream and thrash. But the Home Depot near us has some shopping carts shaped like race-cars and the part where the kid sits faces forward and has a steering wheel. So he looks forward to going to Home Depot specifically because he wants to sit in the shopping cart. So if it's a choice between buying something at Home Depot or somewhere else, I choose HD, even though otherwise it probably wouldn't be my preferred cho
      • They have carts like that at our local grocery (Publix), and they seat 2 kids per cart. So when the wife and I take all 3 to the store, we divy up boys and girls and go racing... (no reason to let the kids have all the fun)
        • dammit!
          That's where all those carts go, they are always gone when I go to the store, :(

          Yes, taking kids with you is hard...
          I have a higher tolerence for delivering repetative verbal (usually) smackdowns. This allows me to take all three kids with me and only be totally wiped out 1/4 of the time. (girls 1, 3, 4).

          I did open the door one day and tell my wife to take the baby because I was 10 seconds away from infantacide (baby was teething).
        • Yeah, they were even wise enough to have a steering wheel for each seat.
  • I can't do anything but agree. Will this be the pre-discussion to the ATL meetup so people can't whine if one of the kids lose control?? ;)
  • Hi Bethanie,

    You are looking at this from an emotional perspective -- which is completely fair, given that it caused you emotional strife. However, look at it from a business owner's perspective. As a business owner, we get a lot of requests from our customers to provide additional services, some of which make business sense for us and some of which are completely random and wouldn't make any sense for us. Here are the questions I ask when considering any business opportunity:

    1) Will this gain us any additio
  • as I am, this should be of interest to you! Our (the boomers) future depends on the children of the "baby bust", they should be applauded for procreating, and yes, rewarded with our gratitude. That could mean just the little things like putting up with minor inconveniences and a kind word on occasion. Let me put this into perspective, have you ever had one of those ubiquitous electric scooters carrying an, elderly/immobile person, smash into your shin? Chances are they continue on without a word of apol

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